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steveoifer

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Reply with quote  #26 
Prophetic!..........
 
Subject: A breeder's worst nightmare!Replies: 43
Posted By: brindles1Views: 1,065
 
   In many cases, people are not what they profess to be. And dogs can end
 up in the wrong hands "even when a breeder has tried to screen them" prior
 to them purchasing a pup.
   Mastiffs are not a breed for the faint-hearted or non-committed individual.
 As they are financially draining, & require things to care for them on a bigger
 scale. I've known people through the years to just get tired of dealing with
 them, then not care who the dogs ended up with.
  And a breeder can be setup by parties in order to be able to purchase
 another dog if you have found them out to be a person you wish no further
 dealings with. I've actually had an ex-wife purchase a dog in Atlanta for
 her ex-husband who resides in CA. She used her maiden name! I had
 refused to sell her ex-husband another Mastiff, so they conspired a plan
 a year later to obtain another pup from me.
  I've learned alot the last 2 years, and there are people breeding Mastiffs
 that are drug users/dealers & also people who have mental disorders. You
 would never have any idea " by looking at their impressive websites!" Or,
 even in just talking with them. The dogs are paying the price!!
  We live in ever changing times, anything goes, so BEWARE.
Forum: Mastiff Message Board
Subject: Dog Breeder Home RaidedReplies: 7
Posted By: brindles1Views: 230
 
     Does not sound like a "puppymill" at all. One of the investigator's said it
    was clean & dogs were in good condition!
     This is how things get taken to extreme's, & could very well happen to
    any person who has multiple dogs.
     More & more laws are being imposed on dog owners. You can get "1"
    disgruntled neighbor, or just a person with a grudge to start causing
    trouble if you own multiple dogs.
     It pays to always research state, county, & city laws and restrictions
    if you own animals "prior to buying a home or land." Even then, sometimes
    new laws get passed.
Subject: ?? about a kennelReplies: 61
Posted By: brindles1Views: 1,276
 
    Steve, you make me "snicker." Every person on this board who can
  read, has seen you make derogatory comments anytime Tobin's
  name comes up. As well as you have done on other boards!
    Tobin was no saint, but he at least had the dogs & wins to leave quite
  a legacy in this breed. No one can ever undermine or erase that part
  in Mastiff history.
 
    Hey Catie...you are so right in your above post. If more people had
  the guts to face the person that they have heard rumors about, &
  ask to hear their side " before spreading lies," we all could see better
  unity as breeders. Stories always get added to & distorted. PLUS, 
  some people like to stick their noses in where they have no business
  to do so.
    Life is hard enough without alot of petty BS !!!!!!!
Subject: Another INTERESTING QUESTIONReplies: 28
Posted By: brindles1Views: 1,210
 
   You meet "all kinds" within the dog world. Some people have even
   used alias's in the past while leading groups of people to believe they
   were experts in the breed.
    You also have people who belong to kennel clubs that threaten
   those they dislike via emails & by phone.
     We might be somewhat shocked to know just how many exhibitors
   out there actually have a felony background of some sort.
      Sadly, it is not surprising to me that dogs have died at the hands of
    mental fruitcakes in the past.
      It is a BIG playing field when you are showing dogs. Watch your
    backs, & be cautious with your dogs!


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For the betterment of the breed

"Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
"If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well." Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything...Catherine McMillan
" A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
"I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
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steveoifer

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Reply with quote  #27 
Subject: male breeders??? rare??Replies: 49
Posted By: brindles1Views: 677
 
  
Quote:
And if we know what we are doing from years of experience, versus
  quoting things from a book, or constantly throwing input on every
  topic, people usually take notice & listen more.( Hint,hint !)

  

As I've stated repeatedly over the years, it takes more than producing puppies in order to become a good breeder!

I think we can all learn a life lesson from Gloria's example!


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For the betterment of the breed

"Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
"If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well." Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything...Catherine McMillan
" A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
"I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
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brandysmom

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Reply with quote  #28 
OMG! I am crying right now just thinking about what those poor pups went through. How awful! catch that B*%@ch and burn her at the stake.
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Jenny
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TeresaE

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Reply with quote  #29 

I have no words to describe my disgust!!  Sickening--absolutely sickening!!


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Teresa Emerson
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mom2boys

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Reply with quote  #30 

The pictures just break my heart and make me sick, I can't get them out of my head.  I hugged my dogs a little tighter last night. 


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Wendi

The great pleasure of a dog is that you may make a fool of yourself with him and not only will he not scold you, but he will make a fool of himself too. ~ Samuel Butler
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Nicci

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Reply with quote  #31 
Quote:
When Gloria lived in Live Oak, FL w/ her lover Martha Taylor there were people who had been to Gloria's and saw not only the conditions but the amount of dogs she was breeding ---- 12-20 different breeds of dogs (Mastiffs, Neos, Saints, Frenchies just to name a few) with multiple bitches of each breed.   Gloria was a backyard, make-shift commercial producer who, would have had to have been inspected by not only AKC but USDA as well due to the number of puppies she was putting on the ground every year.   While the conditions may not have been as bad as they were in TN and NC, they were not ideal for any animal, including cows!
 


This is the absolute truth!  I live in Live Oak, Fl and I know where Gloria use to live.  12-20 different breeds housed in one large windowless metal building.  In the FL heat!  They were lucky to get time outside in the yard.  Complete puppy mill!

Lorie and a few others have been telling people for years what a piece of trash Gloria was.  I think sometimes we need to listen better. 

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trmita920

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Reply with quote  #32 
After reading all of this I am eternally grateful toCarrie for steering me clear of Gloria before she could ever pose the breeding question.  trenton 2008 she was gushing all over Adrian about how wonderful Blu was.  And while I am biased and think he is perfect I would never want one of my pups to wind up with a bitch like her.

Hoping the law gets her soon .  if anyone hears a whisper of where she has surfaced for the sake of the porr dogs memories turn her in.

Let's not leave her alone this is serious and seriously ugly.

theresa
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sandragon

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Reply with quote  #33 

Thanks Connie! Yes I tried some listened some did not. But I did try to tell everyone!


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Rosiemom

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Reply with quote  #34 

This is so terrible, it made me cry. How can anyone do this to any beautiful animal. These people should fry at the stake.

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goldleaf

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Reply with quote  #35 
There is a video available at this link

Mystery Surrounds Dog Breeder’s Disappearance

Woman Not Heard From In Weeks; Several Dogs Starve To Death

POSTED: 6:12 pm EST February 25, 2010
UPDATED: 9:36 pm EST February 25, 2010

Comments
Bookmark and Share
Anderson County investigators are trying to figure out what happened to a well known dog-breeder who has vanished.When officers first went to Gloria Davis’ home, it was to investigate a possible animal neglect case.Anderson County sheriff’s Lt. Garland Major said Davis operates Lion-Hearted Mastiffs, a dog breeding business.Animal control officers found 27 dogs on the property, and the bodies of 10 others that had died of malnutrition. But there was no sign of Davis.The family of Gloria Davis recently reported her missing. Investigators say it's been about two months since her family in Florida has heard from her. Davis’ parents say she usually keeps in touch.
Gloria Davis
Major said, "We find it uncharacteristic of her. According to the family, she hasn’t done this before. So we’ve got a lot of unanswered questions. Why would she pick up and leave?"According to the incident report, Davis' parents say they supposedly received a Valentine's Day card that was supposedly from Davis, but they say it wasn't written in her handwriting.The report also says a man who was questioned at Davis’ home gave deputies several different stories regarding the dog breeder’s whereabouts. In one version, he said Davis left with an unknown woman in a white Ford F350.Anyone with information is asked to call the Anderson County Sheriff’s Office.


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goldleaf

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Reply with quote  #36 
http://helpfindthemissing.org/forum/showthread.php?p=728115

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goldleaf

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Reply with quote  #37 
http://www.independentmail.com/news/2010/feb/24/anderson-county-investigators-looking-missing-dog-/
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newing71

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Reply with quote  #38 

OH MY GOSH!  Its been a while since I've been on here, so when I got on today this is the first thing I saw.  I grew up in Honea Path, which is in southeastern Anderson Co.  I'd never heard of this woman or this "kennel."  I'm outraged.  I know several high people in high places up there.  Is there anything I can do?

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Kiokeemastiffs

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Reply with quote  #39 
  As of this week this investigation has gone from a missing person to a possible homicide.

Fact: no on has spoken directly to Gloria since December. Her parents filed a missing person report in December.

Fact: Kazia was living on the property in the same house--that both she and Gloria Bought--while Gloria's dogs lay dead outside and the others starving.

 Fact: Kazia kept her dogs inside thios home where she cared and fed them.

Fact: every dog pen on the property was within 20-30 feet of the back dooor--so you could see EVERY dog as you entered and left the property.

Fact: Kazia has been and was living on the property during the time this "abuse" occurred.  Kazia can not provide an Alibi to show her presene any where else( i.e. no hospital records).  Her claims to have been away from the home can not be proved.  However it can be shown that her phone and computer was used from the home at that time.

Who's the Monster now?

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Cathy (Catie) C. Arney
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landondale

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Reply with quote  #40 
Oh, gosh!  How sad!  I hope they find what has happened to her! 


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Judi Mott
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goldleaf

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Reply with quote  #41 
I don't know Gloria from Adam, but for the people that do and have been personally touched by this, what are you going to do/how will you feel, if she does show up and has been hiding out?  What then?  I guess it will depend on the circumstances, but this question has always been on my mind.

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brandig

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Reply with quote  #42 

there are soo many stories floating around about where she is or might be and i would never repeat them for fear of saying something wrong but i can tell you the stories i have heard of where they think gloria might be are worse than you can imagine!! i cant even, it's just unthinkable!! gross, oh my gosh how could anyone?? pray for her family and friends and that justice is done!!!


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Hair? what hair? i dont see any hair!!
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CapeWind

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Reply with quote  #43 
Hi Jan,

I lost all respect for her many years ago. Call me naive at the time, but I bought into her lies, and was burnt by her myself.

My website hasn't been edited in over a year due to pc/ftp problems, but been working on that issue. I will be updating my site to contain a MEMORIAL PAGE for Lionhearted Back In Black, who some know is MINE (she was a Clifford littermate). I foolishly sent "Raven" to her 8 years ago as a stud fee. I will be including copies of every newspaper article I can find.

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Geri MacDonald
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Mastiffs Raised Naturally
Cape Cod, MA
http://capewindmastiffs.com
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Kiokeemastiffs

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Reply with quote  #44 
Geri, if you want to be fair--then wait until the final story is in.  Yes, post and tell your story--and Raven's in what ever manner you wish.  But what you may think is truth today--may in fact be a misrepresentation when all the truths are known.

Don't let your present anger dictate what you say and do.  You may be angry at the wrong person.

Before you start making statements--wait for the truth.  If you place something up--and it turns out to be false--that's slander and libel.   Just think first.

As much as you may not like to hear this--you bred to Gloria's KIng to get Clifford.  Gloria went went back to breed to him because he was out of her lines. Your dogs are based on some of her lines.

Gloria was heart broken when you had your fire and lost your dogs.  She called me and told me about it and she cried.  Yes, She and you had problems  but she still mourned for the lost of your dogs.  I wish you could do the same for her.

Raven was a wonderful dog and hopefully some of her puppies will continue to contribute to our breed--thus, your Clifford will also be contributing to the breed. 

Both you and Gloria lost in this tragety.  Don't be so quick to place blame.  There is much to the story that can not be told at this time.

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Cathy (Catie) C. Arney
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Reply with quote  #45 
Hi Catie,

Three things.

#1 - I have EVERY right to post a MEMORIAL for MY dog. I will include ALL articles I find. They MAY find Gloria responsible for what recently happend, or they MAY support homicide. If anyone ASKS ME how MY dog died, all I can say is it was by a BULLET. Others can form their own opinions. 

#2 - Gloria NEVER asked to use Clifford, NOR WOULD I EVER EVER EVER OFFER him to her. I only followed through with ONE person's interests in using him, and his collection at that time wasn't worth using. THE ONLY LITTERS Clifford EVER sired were out of MY bitch Ch Iron Hills Girl Next Door. If there is ANY LITTER ANYWHERE out of another bitch, with ANYONE other then me listed as the breeder of his litters, it is FRAUD. Either YOU don't have your facts straight, or Gloria LIED to YOU.

#3 - Don't you EVER tell me that BOTH Gloria and I "lost". THE DOGS LOST!!! I made a tradgic mistake eight years ago. A mistake that I have had to live with. EVEN IF, Gloria didn't do this final act AGAINST MY DOG, and EVEN IF Gloria loved "Raven" in HER WAY, Gloria knew damn well that I did NOT approve of the care MY DOG received.

These are the FACTS. NO misrepresentations! NO slander! Just the FACTS!



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Geri MacDonald
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Kiokeemastiffs

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Reply with quote  #46 
Just don't let anger dictate your actions.  That's not too much to ask.

Go for it--what ever you put up is what people will also remember about you--so if it turns out not to be completely true--  It may make you look like an ass.  If you are willing to take that chance because you have all the facts--fire away.

Sorry__I thought Raven was out of Clifford my mistake.  I misunderstood.

However you do have dogs out of Gloria's lines--that part I did have correct.  Anything you state about Gloria may also reflect on you in the eyes of some people.  Some of us who bred to her dogs or who own dogs from her have been comdemened to be just as guilty by  a few members in the Mastiff community.  We are guilty by association in their eyes.

I don't think anyone crucified you after the fire--no one pointed fingers at you and blamed you.  The response from the mastiff community was of loving support and understanding.

The death of these dogs may not be Gloria's fault.    We do know that Kazia was living in that house and was present while those dogs lay dead and while the others stood starving in the pen.  Looks like Someone else   could very well  be the responsible party.  Wouldn't you rather blame the person who is responsible?  I don't hear you ranting about her--just Gloria.

Many of us feel Gloria is dead--not just missing.  If she has been missing since mid-December  as ome of us fear--then she is not the responsible person for what happened to those dogs.  However, the time line of her dissappearence is uncertain, so That is still to be determined.

So untill Gloria is found dead or alive--we will not have all the answers. 

Ask and pray for justice and answers.


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Cathy (Catie) C. Arney
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CapeWind

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Reply with quote  #47 
Thanks for the advice Catie, but I'm not the type to say untruthful things in anger. I really don't know what I will put on Raven's page until I sit down to write it, but anything I do write will be based on FACTS.


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Geri MacDonald
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Cape Cod, MA
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CapeWind

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Reply with quote  #48 
*** First of all Catie, when I made post #50, all you had written was, and I'll quote ... "Just don't let anger dictate your actions."

That's not too much to ask.
*** As I said, I will stick to FACTS.

Go for it--what ever you put up is what people will also remember about you--so if it turns out not to be completely true--  It may make you look like an ass.  If you are willing to take that chance because you have all the facts--fire away.
*** Aside from what has been posted here by you, my #1 fact is I FOOLISHLY sent a puppy to a women who lied and screwed MANY people. THAT my dear is FACT. You also confirmed on the phone, as a person who KNEW THE DOGS, AND took their BODIES to be creamated, that MY dog was one of the dogs shot. So unless YOU have lied, I have stuck to FACTS. Posting ALL of the newspapers articles will post information as it was publically known, no matter which way the story unfolds. THAT is staying NEUTRAL to the situation, and NOT rushing to judgement. Others can take all the information and form THEIR OWN OPINIONS.

Sorry__I thought Raven was out of Clifford my mistake.  I misunderstood.
*** HOW did you misunderstand that? I still have the email I sent you via Facebook, where I clearly stated Raven was MY breeding, and I even told you she was a LITTERMATE to Clifford, as I knew you knew of him. You wrote me back with your phone number to call you for the facts.

However you do have dogs out of Gloria's lines--that part I did have correct.  
*** Sure do, and the work of OTHER breeders as well! Contrary to popular belief, are YOU aware that Gloria was NOT King's breeder??? Do you even know WHO was? Or what the situation was surrounding that breeding? Please do tell me WHAT Gloria accomplished in her 25-30 years in this breed? SHE did NOT plan MY breeding. I went to her, with BETTER then what she had to offer. I bred to a DOG, for certain traits to correct the faults in MY bitch, knowing damn well it would take generations to fix the "baggage" I would get in that pedigree. I didn't breed to a LINE. What was behind King did NOT make a "line" for Gloria. King was primarily the work of OTHERS. ALL Gloria did was slap her name on King, in the same way she did Raven. Gloria wanted Raven because she was dark. I tried to talk Gloria out of her as she was a PET. Am I *allowed* to bash MY OWN DOGS??? She was TINY and LACKED TYPE. Gloria didn't CARE what QUALITY she produced. SHE was about smoke and mirrors.

Anything you state about Gloria may also reflect on you in the eyes of some people. 
*** Oh please, do you think after all these years I care about what others think? My view is simple. Take me as I am, or don't take me at all. I have no hidden agendas. I also don't sugarcoat things. Life is too short to live in glass houses.

Some of us who bred to her dogs or who own dogs from her have been comdemened to be just as guilty by  a few members in the Mastiff community.  We are guilty by association in their eyes.
*** Get over it! If someone is going to judge you for someone else's actions, that is on them, not you. You are responsible for YOUR actions.

I don't think anyone crucified you after the fire--no one pointed fingers at you and blamed you.  The response from the mastiff community was of loving support and understanding.
*** Do you really want to go here? Your anology is poor at best. I DO blame myself for Sassy, Clifford, Phoebe, Echo and Dragon's deaths. HAD I BEEN LIKE GLORIA, the dogs would have been living in pens up to their hocks in mud and feces, but INSTEAD, they lived INSIDE OUR HOME, where they were cared for constantly, not just fed/watered a couple times a day. UNLIKE GLORIA, when I had a personal issue beyond my control, not all that long ago at that, I also wasn't afraid to ask for help! The dogs in MY care have never suffered at MY hands. 

The death of these dogs may not be Gloria's fault.   
*** That MAY be true, but the WAY they LIVED was her fault. You can defend her til the cows come home, but it will change NOTHING.

Wouldn't you rather blame the person who is responsible?  I don't hear you ranting about her--just Gloria.
*** I wasn't doing much ranting at all before my responses to you. My response to Jan was short, but factual. I plan to make a MEMORIAL PAGE for MY dog, and WILL post ALL the newspaper articles I can find. What part of this do you find confusing?

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Geri MacDonald
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sandragon

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Reply with quote  #49 
Good for you Geri!!!

I am sorry about Raven as I am for Tilly and Max. Those poor dogs did not deserve what happened to them.



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Lorie
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CapeWind

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Reply with quote  #50 
Thanks Lori, but I am not overly proud of myself for speaking my mind. I won't delete it, as I meant every word I wrote, but it was just in poor taste on my part:-( I need to go back to just lurking, as I really am not in a good place right now. Raven should have been celebrating her birthday less then two weeks ago, and the third anniversity of the fire is the end of the month. While I hope Gloria is just in hiding, I am tired of hearing EXCUSES for Gloria. She made her bed, whatever it was, she can lay in it. Whether she pulled the trigger or not, it just doesn't matter to me. DOGS ARE DEAD, and others HAVE suffered, directly at Gloria's hand. The ONLY thing I am praying for at this point is the OTHER breeders can get THEIR dogs back, and ALL of them end up in GREAT homes where they can be PETS for the rest of their lives!

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Geri MacDonald
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Mastiffs Raised Naturally
Cape Cod, MA
http://capewindmastiffs.com
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